TRANSPORT minister, Joram Gumbo (JG) together with Foreign Affairs
minister, Simbarashe Mumbengegwi are the two most senior Zanu PF
officials in the Midlands after Vice-President Emmerson Mnangagwa.
Midlands, together with Masvingo, have of late come under
harsh criticism from President Robert Mugabe and first lady Grace Mugabe for
allegedly fanning divisions in the ruling party.
Standard reporter, Blessed Mhlanga (BM) on Friday spoke to
Gumbo about Mnangagwa’s alleged presidential ambitions, the poisoning saga and
factionalism, among other issues. Below are excerpts from the interview.
BM: You are one of the most senior Zanu PF leaders in the
Midlands, which is being ravaged by factionalism. How deep does it run?
JG: To be honest with you, factionalism is difficult to
detect. What I normally find are cliques and not factionalism as such because
in the Midlands Province, there is always allegiance to the leadership that is
there.
When Mnangagwa was not vice-president, he was leader of the
province. He just led us to believe and never to think otherwise but
just to say our leader is President [Robert] Mugabe until he leaves office.
Whoever he appoints must be respected. What I am hearing
now is an issue of cliques. You find that there is a grouping of people who
might say they want Gumbo and you find another who might say they want
Mumbengegwi.
I am giving you just examples of two top people in the
province at the moment and [people might group themselves around them,]leading
to talk about factionalism.
BM: So this talk that Midlands is ravaged by factionalism
does not hold water?
JG: Definitely not in the Midlands. Other than cliques,
there is no factionalism. Even if you go around the country, I have been around,
I have been to Masvingo, I chaired Masvingo myself.
What I discovered was that the leadership there would make
preferences of people they want in positions and the group would also make
preferences for their own people. if that is what people call factionalism,
then the whole country is full of factionalism.
BM: What you are describing, is that not factionalism?
JG: My understanding of factionalism would be to say people
who would be working against President Mugabe and prefer somebody to be leader
and that is nonsensical.
Any sane person in Zimbabwe will tell you that vaMugabe is
not easy to challenge and if you want to do that, you only do that at your own
peril.
BM: You know Mnangagwa?
JG: Yes,very well.
BM: Does he harbour any ambitions?
JG: He doesn’t. He has always been accused from the time he
was security chief, from war time, from when he was the president’s personal
assistant.
People always called him the blue-eyed boy for vaMugabe.
That’s what they have always been calling him.
Now it’s a step higher from what he was being called before
he became vice-president. Now that he has become VP, some people are saying he
wants to take over.
BM: If indeed he has no ambition to dethrone Mugabe, what
is the motive of these people?
JG: I don’t know. It can best be answered by them, but what
I know is that Mnangagwa’s loyalty to President Mugabe is unquestionable.
Very much unquestionable and that’s what we all believe in
the Midlands. He is one person that I know for a fact that he does not
harbour any intentions of taking over from vaMugabe.
Unless appointed to do so by vaMugabe and unless the
president says I am stepping down, then maybe he may want to stand, if he wants
to stand.
BM: You were once caretaker chairperson in both Masvingo
and Midlands. The first lady on Friday named Midlands and Masvingo as problem
provinces in the party. Is there any sinister pact that these two provinces
have entered into?
JG: There is nothing. What is there between Midlands and
Masvingo is that it’s a block of Karanga people.
There is nothing [sinister]. Masvingo has its own
leadership, Midlands has its own leadership, we are totally separate. We only
meet as provinces, as supporters of Zanu PF when we do party business.
BM: I know you were with the VP when he was taken ill.
Where did this ice-cream narrative come from?
JG: It’s coming from the newspapers. They are just making
up stories and that cannot disturb Mnangagwa or myself.
I was in Gwanda myself, Mnangagwa never ate any ice-cream.
But I could see that he was not walking straight as he was coming to the stage
and that’s all I realised and the next thing I was told that he was vomiting.
After that, when we went to check on him he was already on
the plane going to Harare via Gweru. But because of these groupings which I call cliques myself,
people started making noise about it.
They said he had been poisoned by so and so, he had done
this and so on and so forth because in politics people are eager to divide
people and when you get divided then some people will be going up the ladder to
take leadership positions.
BM: You insist that there is no succession problems in Zanu
PF yet we know that the politburo is seized with this matter and Mnangagwa is
being accused of attempting to unseat his boss.
JG: There was nothing like that. It was just talk about
what had happened in Mashonaland central. That’s what I know. People [were]
actually responding to issues after (Jacob) Mudenda had presented his report.
People are free to comment, you see, they can comment and
say whatever they want to say and if you are a real politician, you don’t
follow newspaper comments.
BM: But these allegations are real. politburo member
Jonathan Moyo has actually taken to Twitter accusing the VP of being a
successionist. Why would he go to that extent if there are no issues?
JG: That is best answered by him and not me.
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